Strange LED behavior on Switches

[Mfryd]

Every once in a while I notice that all of the LEDS on all of my Insteon switches/keypads put on a LED "light show".


Without anyone touching any of the switches, I will notice the LEDs on all the Insteon switches & Keypads in the room start blinking for a few seconds. Some of the switches are right next to each other, but the switches on the other side of the room are also going crazy. After 5 to 10 seconds, everything goes back to normal.

Does anybody know what causes this? Should I be worried about it?

Other than this occasional LED light show, everything seems to be working.

My home has a few dozen Insteon switches keypads, and an ISY controller.

[stusviews]

Right click on a problematic SwitchLinc, select Options. Uncheck LED on TX.

[Mfryd]

[QUOTE=stusviews;n87047]Right click on a problematic SwitchLinc, select Options. Uncheck LED on TX.[/QUOTE]

It's not a single SwitchLinc, it's all of them.

I don't get the blinking if I use the SwitchLinc to turn a device On/Off.

I don't get the blinking if I use a Mini-Remote to turn a SwitchLinc On/Off.

I don't get the blinking if the ISY sends turns something On/Off.

I do get the blinking when the system otherwise seems idle. When things start blinking all the buttons on 6 and 8 button keypads light up and blink.

[stusviews]

Do you have a TED installed or a smart electric meter on anything that monitors energy?

[Mfryd]

[QUOTE=stusviews;n87055]Do you have a TED installed or a smart electric meter on anything that monitors energy?[/QUOTE]


The local power company has installed a "smart meter", but it only communicates with the power company (Florida Power & Light). I have nothing in my house that actually talks to the smart meter, or anything that tracks electrical usage.

The utility power here is not very clean. I use LED bulbs in most of my fixtures, and it isn't unusual to see them flicker, even when the SwitchLinc is at 100%.

I do have a whole house generator, and an automatic transfer switch, but the episodes of blinking LEDs on the Insteon switches occurs at times where the backup generator is off.

I don't really understand enough about the SwitchLincs or the Insteon protocols, but it sort of looks like all the switches have "crashed" and are all rebooting at once. I say this because the blinking LEDs remind me of a power up light test sequence.

[BLH]

The signals the Smart Meter sends back to the power company. Also gets into your home.
Depending on the exact meter and signaling used. It can cause their signals to effect home automation systems.
The signals can be fairly high in voltage if the signals are not getting back to the power company. Their data hub transmitters just up the power of the signal if it gets too low.
I have seen special filters for the signals reported to start absorbing the signals and the transmitters just up the power to compensate.

[stusviews]

The most likely culprit is the Smart meter.

[Mfryd]

OK. Let's assume the smart meter is putting a signal on the line. What is the signal doing to the SwitchLincs?


Is the smart meter signal actually confusing the SwitchLincs so much that they really are all crashing and rebooting? If so, is this something that might get fixed in new firmware (I don't think that an unrecognized signal should crash a well programed device).

I guess I'm trying to get a better understanding of my Insteon system. What are the SwitchLinc/KeyPad Lins LEDs telling me by having them by flashing for a few seconds?

I'm looking for a slightly better overview than "It's from the smart meter". I'd settle for "the smart meter is making the switches crash", or "the smart meter is causing massive interference, and this is how the SwitchLinc alerts you to massive errors on the line".

[stusviews]

Any signals on the power line can affect HA devices. Depending on the particular signal, a HA device many and can react (not respond) the that signal. There is no way to make HA device impervious to every power line signal. If the errant signal is caused by a device in your home, then a filter is called for, but there's no way to filter signals that emanate from an external device that connects to the electric distribution panel (circuit breaker box).

Some smart meters have filtering built in. others don't. You may want to contact your power company.

[Mfryd]

OK.

But we've skipped a step.

My Insteon switches are displaying a behavior that isn't mentioned in their instruction manual.

Does anybody actually know what the behavior means? Has anybody else ever seen this behavior?

I don't want to get into an argument with my power company if it turns out the real issues is my ISY controller is issuing an "All Unit Light Test" or similar command.

Is this a symptom of too many devices and messages bouncing around the network too much?

As terms of making a HA automation device impervious to any signal, you are correct. However, as a general rule, if they see a signal that they don't recognize, they shouldn't crash. I've written my share of firmware and software, I would be very surprised if Insteon devices didn't do a basic sanity check on input. My guess is the light patterned is a pre-programmed status message. I just don't know what the units are trying to tell me.

[BLH]

Some of the Switchlincs had a feature blink on traffic. If there is noise that it thinks is traffic it will blink the LEDs.
Not sure if the latest firmware still has the feature.
In the Options Tab for the module in the modules ISY entry. Does it also show a blink on traffic check box?

Is there any lights in the house that also flash randomly and are not on an Insteon module?

[Mfryd]

The issue isn't the light bulbs flashing, it's the LEDs on the Insteon switches.

The "LED on TX" option is turned off. When I turn this on, only the currently lit light of the SwitchLinc flashes when that SwitchLinc Transmits. My symptom is that all the LEDs on all the SwitchLincs and KeyPadLincs are flashing.

I have one room with a 2476D v.37 and a 2477D v.41 behind a faceplate on one side of the room, and two 2477 v.43 SwitchLincs on the other side of the room. My ISY only allows me to set "options" for the 2477D.

If this was the Blink on traffic option, it wouldn't simultaneously be affecting all the SwitchLincs, as they don't all transmit at once, and not all my Insteon switches have this feature.




Please remember, that I am not talking about the room lighting flashing or blinking. I am talking about all of the LEDs on the SwitchLincs and KeyPadLincs. I'm pretty sure they are trying to tell me something, I just don't know what it is.



As a separate issue some of my LED room lights do occasionally blink off for a fraction of a second. This seems to be an issue with that particular cheap brand of LED not being tolerant of poor quality utility power. Other brands of bulbs in other rooms do not have that problem. Eventually, I'll put in different bulbs (or we will get the neighborhood utility wires put underground) and I expect that issue will go away. I'm not asking about this issue, I am asking about the LEDs on every installed SwitchLinc and KeyPadLinc simultaneous blinking for a few seconds every once in a while.

[stusviews]

If you mean the "set" LEDs and not the On-level LEDs on the side of dimmers nor the button LED on KeypadLincs, then yes, the blinking is a symptom of power line activity, not necessarily Insteon signals.

[Mfryd]

I mean all the LEDs. This includes the "set" LEDs, the On-Level LEDs on the sides of the SwitchLincs, and the button LEDs on the KeypadLincs. All these LEDs start blinking on all my SwitchLincs and KeypadLincs. They blink for a few seconds and then return to their normal state.

I'll be eating dinner and out of the corner of my eye, I see on the of the devices blinking. I look around, and can see that all of them are blinking, even the ones I can see in the next room.

I might notice this happening one or two times in an evening. Most days I don't notice it at all.


If this was a symptom of power line activity, I would see it much more often. I would see it whenever there is Insteon activity on the line. This is not the case.

[stusviews]

The phenomena you are seeing [I]is[/I] power line activity, but it's not Insteon activity. I still suspect the smart meter.