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Armed/Disarmed state: Like a basic security system need.

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  • #31
    Oh, and to everyone sane here on this thread, you might want to do what I just did and email Insteon customer service and ask them if these moderators are really the people they want representing them to their customers.

    Figured I would post this before the moderators ban me.


    • #32
      Relax, no one here is getting banned. If having a difference of opinion caused someone to be banned, both Stu and I would've been thrown out years ago!

      I do get the impression we're at an impasse. Everybody's had a chance to speak their mind, to make point and counter-point, to make a case and/or refute it. At this point, it looks like the participants are pretty fixed in their respective opinions. In the end, it is up to Insteon to decide if they want to change direction or stay the course.

      Seriously, I wouldn't mind if they came out with a security system at all, so long as they incorporated all the necessary security features. I wouldn't want to see something using current sensors or Hub, however, since there are already so many cheap, poorly executed D-I-Y alarm systems already occupying the hardware store shelves. From my perspective, if they do it they should do it right, which means more expensive components designed specifically for the task, but I understand other opinions may differ.

      Enjoy the holidays, everybody!


      • #33
        wow mefree, you seem to be awfully worked up by the fact that people are recommending that you not do what you are doing yet are providing information anyways. I too would be covering my ass if I was giving advice for using something in a way it wasn't designed to be used in an effort to not be liable. I suggest you NOT read the warning on a Q-tip box, you may have a heart attack and rage kill CEOs or something.


        • #34
          I'm quite new to Insteon and Home Automation in general but after setting up my Hub, Thermostat, a few lights, Smoke bridge with a Hard wired detector, and a leak sensor in my basement my next thought was similar to this thread. I like the fact that the smoke bridge and leak detector text me any time of day, but why would you want to be text about your main entry door 24/7? People are saying these sensors are for triggering devices but why would you want a motion sensor or door sensor alerting 24/7? If it's not meant for alerting then why is it an option in the app? It just doesn't make sense to treat the settings the same as the Smoke and Water Sensors.

          ocdtrekkie was correct in pointing out that the kit being sold as "Assurance Home Automation Starter Kit" is a little misleading. I would install a motion sensor in my kitchen facing my main entry door and I would be "assured" over 100 times per day via text that there was motion in the house. I'm not looking for complicated if/then programming but I picture something like an 'alert scene' where sensors could be on and off during certain times or a scene full of sensors turned off when you're home. I see this isn't the case but it's something that seems doable with some easy changes and not need an ISY just to do this.

          I think the Moderators are a little out of line in the way they handled this thread. Nobody was really asking for this to be a security system by any means. They were just asking to turn on and off a few sensors at once "like" you would with a security system. I was surprised by their approach to some simple questions. Get it together.


          • #35
            It would certainly be helpful for them to add a Home/Away switch in the app and a 'disable alert when Home' choice in each alert.


            • #36
              I enjoy reading these sort of threads because it entertains me a great deal. I find it extremely sad when there are hundreds of products that do actual security which provide all the requirements that is needed to meet the needs of the users and the insurance company. Yet, some of these people want to use something that is clearly NOT intended to secure your home make it so??

              Yes, you can certainly use a screw driver and hammer on it like its a chisel. But, there is a proper tool for said task which will also save you an eye from a exploding screw driver tip!

              You can certainly use a brick to smash down a nail. But, a hammer is the correct tool for the intended task along with safety! This isn't about being *Safety Nancy* this is about education and providing the correct information to the general public.

              No more . . .

              In my line of work its called measured response vs risk / reward.

              Lets be blunt here shall we: Only the cheap, uneducated, and those who think they know more than people who work in the Security industry believe a HA device will supersede a real security alarm device. Every day I am surrounded by fools who think because they have an App this will protect their family???


              The last time I checked an App wasn't able to stop a person from kicking down a door. Or when the sump pump failed these same *insane* people thought they were better than a CS (Central Station) and were once again too cheap to pay $6.99 for alarm monitoring! These same people think they don't need to sleep, eat, take a crap, be somewhere where there is no cell signal, be around the world on holidays, yet when they get this little sms text, e-mail they think its going to help them??


              Oh yes, they are going to reach out to the person next door and have them take a look?? Guess you forgot Bob is on vacation too, or is at work, not in cell range etc.

              When your entire house is filled with smoke and you're knocked out cold. These same people who are self monitoring truly believe they can wake up and do something??

              You're dreaming . . .

              A CS has only one goal and that is watch, monitor, alert, and notify you, back up, police, EMS, Fire 24/7/365 with out fail. The sad fact is these same cheap fools will throw rocks at a HA product because it didn't secure their home??

              *Shakes head in disbelief*

              At the end of the day its the misuse of HA products which reflects poorly on the market as a whole. As many others have mentioned Insteon is a great method to add layers to an existing and *REAL* security alarm system. It is not intended to supersede it as the primary device for the life and safety of the occupants and the home.

              People really need to wake up, and stop being stupid, this isn't rocket science.
              Teken . . .


              • #37
                Looks like INSTEON went more with me, and less with the forum moderators:


                • #38
                  Originally posted by ocdtrekkie View Post
                  Looks like INSTEON went more with me, and less with the forum moderators:
                  So because they offered a module that chimes and can be linked to a battery operated device. You believe that replaces the need to have a real security alarm system installed and monitored by a certified CS?

                  I just have to shake my head in disbelief in how some people reason and use circular logic to make a point.
                  Want to make a real difference? Please cast your vote to make the PLM Pro a reality:


                  • #39
                    Teken, as we emphasized multiple times before, the request wasn't for "a real security alarm system installed and monitored by a certified CS". If I had or wanted that, I wouldn't buy INSTEON hardware at all, because most of those services now offer home automation modules integrated with them.


                    • #40
                      Not designed to do that; Can't be done.


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by ocdtrekkie View Post
                        Teken, as we emphasized multiple times before, the request wasn't for "a real security alarm system installed and monitored by a certified CS". If I had or wanted that, I wouldn't buy INSTEON hardware at all, because most of those services now offer home automation modules integrated with them.

                        At the end of the day so long as your expectations are properly set out, that's fine. What I take issue is seeing, reading, and watching others use devices which were never purpose built, designed, certified, and intended for securing life and property. There are tens of thousands of devices that have been designed for that single purpose.

                        Insteon isn't one of them . . .

                        The real issue is because there are so many people reading the Interwebs that have no common sense and believe just because someone else did it well that's perfectly fine?!?!

                        It isn't, and some of the blame does lie upon Smarthome in alluding this sort of solution will provide the means to do so. Given American is the most litigate country in the world it won't be a surprise a person will do the very same above and then cry fowl when it doesn't offer the protection they were looking for.

                        As has been said years before I was ever born the rarest element in the known universe is *Common Sense*.

                        This whole discussion reminds me of the pet rock. As there were something in the order of 26 million people who were too stupid to go outside and paint their own rock and put random things on it. But decided it was better to spend hard earned money on buying the very same said rock from someone else!

                        26 million people certainly can't be wrong right?!?!

                        Just because you can do a thing doesn't mean you should . . .
                        Want to make a real difference? Please cast your vote to make the PLM Pro a reality:


                        • #42
                          The Pet Rock was all about the packaging and instructions. If you used your own rock, you'd have to figure out how to crate train it yourself.


                          • #43


                            • #44
                              I/O Link 2450 is compatible with the hub and apps. It can be programmed to open or close a relay. It may be programmed to momentarily close its relay. Therefor we may program it to respond to a motion sensor and momentarily close its relay. If we hard wire that relay to the wireless open/close sensor 2843 we may use that to send us an alert. To enable we turn alerts on for the 2843. To disable we turn them off. If you program the motion sensor to email an email address you may look at that email address to see what alarm went off. Multiple devices may be programmed to momentarily close the relay.

                              We may put a second I/O Link 2450 relay output in series with the first one. Then turn that relay on (closed) to enable the alarm, or off (open) to disable the alarm. Keep the wireless switch sensor closed alert on all the time. Much simpler to enable and disable your alarm system.

                              It might not be a paid professional 24/7 security system. It might be impossible to battery back up the hub. Plus we need to backup the internet, I/O Links, and Cameras... Plus we need to let our phone alert us in the middle of the night. And we will have to sleep with our phone (though some of us do). But still its nice to know if someone opens our front door when we are out of town. Or if our smoke detectors are going off when we are not home. After all, why would we buy and install motion detectors, switches or a smoke bridge if we weren't going to use their alerts?

                              Lastly Push notifications do not work for me. I see no method of turning them off by device. I'm currently turning them off for each device and in the overall settings to see if I only get one text message instead of multiple messages. I would have thought that turning off Push notifications for a device and entering an email address would only deliver the email address. I am using for my email address to send a text message to my phone. But my phone is getting two text messages instead of one. So I've disable Push notifications on the main settings page to see if that stops the second message from coming through. Next I'll try Push on for the device and off for settings. Its stuff like this that makes setting up Insteon so frustrating. The fact that we have to hunt through multiple screens and try multiple settings to get it the way we want it.

                              Good luck turning Insteon into an unapproved security system. But wait, didn't Insteon just start selling a siren? Maybe that's just intended to be an output to annoy the neighbors.