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    #31
    Stu, I do not see why there would need to be an ongoing cost for providing two programmed values for sunrise and sunset offsets. There is a programming cost of course to provide the feature enhancement and with the current expenditure levels on the Hub Android app it is clear that it is not an environment that Insteon seems willing to support to an extent comparable to iOS, so any expectation is somewhat moot. If it were at least added to the iOS app, it would be even further incentive to buy an old iOS device and give up on the Android app. That may be what they are hoping will occur,

    For me, I have set my location in Lake Ontario just south of Prince Edward County Ontario, and so my lights come on about 15 minutes earlier that they would normally. Only my porch lights remain on all night and the fact they also turn off too soon is not a major inconvenience.

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      #32
      There would not be an on-going cost. I didn't claim that. Only that the cost would not be trivial. What seems like a simple request would add to the cost of the Hub. That's because adding that feature includes much, much more, which I agree would be nice, but the Hub would no longer be a low cost entry level device.

      Think of the innovation of color TV. It's not just the cost of the CRT, but the entire circuitry needed to be redesigned and many more parts added while maintaining compatibility with the then predominately B&W broadcasters.

      BTW, I've been around long enough to know circuitry of that time using vacuum tubes, way before solid state devices (i.e., transistors) as well as what's currently involved with coding, starting with BASIC and Pascal, even more.

      Adding a time offset opens up the need for a bunch of changes, not the least of which is a more powerful microprocessor or very involved changes in the circuitry to compensate for a limited microprocessor and, most likely, more ROM.
      Message from Forum Admin: stusviews passed away in April 2018. Stu was a huge fan of Insteon and a huge presence on both the Smarthome and Insteon forums, helping thousands of us along the way (he had nearly 20,000 posts to his name). We thank him for his contributions, dedication, and passion for making the Smart Home a reality. He will truly be missed.
      Saving energy is not always free. Be a world saver.

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        #33
        Stu, I had not meant to attribute something to you that you had not intended. I must have misinterpreted "Suppose it costs a penny to maintain a time offset (a made up cost)". thinking that the "maintain" meant "ongoing".

        It would be fascinating to be able to see the sort of code that is running in the Hub and app and then we would not need to speculate as to the complexity of the task, nor whether any additional hardware would be needed to support it. I have been involved in many programming projects and certainly making changes is not always easy. However the fact that I can effectively create an offset by changing the location (and could change it again overnight to effect a change for the sunrise time) means that it cannot take much more hardware!

        Best regards

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          #34
          In order to keep the Hub as a low cost entry level device, a minimal microprocessor is used-it's maxed out. There's no reason not to add features if it was economically practical.
          Message from Forum Admin: stusviews passed away in April 2018. Stu was a huge fan of Insteon and a huge presence on both the Smarthome and Insteon forums, helping thousands of us along the way (he had nearly 20,000 posts to his name). We thank him for his contributions, dedication, and passion for making the Smart Home a reality. He will truly be missed.
          Saving energy is not always free. Be a world saver.

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            #35
            The problem with adding basic features is; where does it stop? For those who desires offset, its a piece of cake and not a big deal. What about those who want geofencing? Or those those who want a count down from when a device turns on.

            Its a never ending story when it comes to features. Like Stusviews said, "its an entry level device". Many things we would love for it to do it just doesnt make sense financially without increasing the cost of the device or potentially causing additional issues.

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